Wednesday, August 30, 2017

So Why Did We Get the 120-Horsepower 1.6 i-DTEC in the 2018 Honda CR-V?


When Honda Cars Philippines launched the 2018 Honda CR-V, the single, most controversial aspect had nothing to do with its styling or number of seats. Keyboard warriors zoomed in quickly at the 1.6-liter i-DTEC engine, or more specifically, why we got different power and torque outputs compared to say, the Thailand version.

As a bit of a refresher, the 2018 CR-V is Honda Cars Philippines’s first-ever diesel offering. Displacing 1.6 liters, it develops 120 horsepower and 300 Nm of torque. The N16, as the engine’s called, features an aluminum block, chain-driven camshafts, a high-pressure common rail direct injection system, and a variable geometry turbocharger.

It’s not exactly new since Honda rolled it out as part of their Earth Dreams Technology in 2011. In fact, this engine was specifically designed for the European market and has been put in the hood of the previous-generation CR-V since 2013. You can even find it in the current European market Civic as well.

Apart from the obvious weight saving benefits over a larger displacement engine, this 1.6-liter engine features extensively reduced mechanical friction (comparable to that of gasoline engines according to Honda) and carbon dioxide output. This all makes for a smoother, quieter, and more environmentally-friendly ride. (More info on the 1.6 i-DTEC here).

Honda managed to change the power and torque output by varying the type of turbocharger used. The 120-horsepower version uses a single variable nozzle turbocharger while the 160-horsepower engine uses a two-stage turbocharger that works in sequence. The first one, a low-pressure turbo activates at low speeds while another high-pressure turbo operates at higher engine speeds.

Now the question beckons: why did we get the “lowly” 120-horsepower variant?

The long and short of it is, according to product engineers at Honda Cars Philippines, a decision based on Philippine driving, environmental, and emission standards. Of course, other factors such as market preference towards fuel efficiency and cost were also considered.

Taking a balanced approach to powertrain development (Honda matches engine and transmission options for each model to a specific target in aspects of both driving dynamics and fuel efficiency), they are confident of the CR-V’s performance.

Though we have yet to drive the all-new CR-V, data pointing at the previous-generation CR-V reveals that the 120-horsepower i-DTEC accelerates to 100 km/h some 13 percent slower (11.2 seconds) compared to the 160-horsepower variant (9.7 seconds).

While that gets some people bummed out a bit, it’s worth noting that it’s still matches or is faster than most Pickup-based Passenger Vehicles (PPVs) in the market such as the Fortuner 2.4 (13.2 seconds), Montero Sport 2.4 MIVEC (11.7 seconds), Everest 3.2 (11.6 seconds). And considering the how the 2018 CR-V is priced? We think it’s looking to be a compact crossover bargain.

65 comments:

  1. Accent has more hp than this shit they're trying to rack down our throats

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  2. "...decision based on Philippine driving, environmental, and emission standards. Of course, other factors such as market preference towards fuel efficiency and cost were also considered"

    This statement just shows how "inferior" PH standards compared to its neighbors... how low can you go PH?

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    1. The bottom line is that HONDA is not capable of dealing with the environment in the Philippines..

      Please note.. OTHER CAR BRANDS does not have that problem (or excuses) that Honda is giving us for only offering 120hp in our country..

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  3. soul has 129hp 270nm :D

    http://hihey.gjamoroso.com

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  4. Honda is just making excuses. This is their first diesel in our market and if a lot of problems arise, Honda's brand recognition will flop. Honda's trying to make a good first impression with their Diesel motor by playing safe. I'm guessing if sales don't pick-up, they'll release the high-powered 1.6 DTEC.

    Mazda on the other hand was able to bring its high-powered 2.2 Skyactiv-D here.

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    1. At 2.2m for a small suv? Good luck with that mazda

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    2. Why not, you pay more for a better car. Simple as that. The TOTL CR-V is also 2M. So 2M for a dtuned 120hp car? Only ricer fanb0is would find that a good deal. LOLZ

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  5. Their explanation seems fair enough. But they should've at least made the 160hp available on indent order basis even if it costs more

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    1. Their reason is their reason.. it's up to the buyer to accept it.. I hope the buyers will NOT accept it.. just to teach Honda a lesson..

      Honda is presenting all these excuses but other car brands does not have any issue with Phillipines condition or type of fuel we have here..

      What Honda is saying here is.. Other car brands are better than us in dealing with the condition of the Philippines..

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  6. Honda has released an underpowered CRV with an overpowered price!

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    1. If Honda's diesel engines are so great then why will Honda no longer offer a diesel powered 2018 CRV in European markets(auto express uk) where 49% of all new passenger vehicles sold there in 2016 were diesel powered?

      It appears that Honda is dumping their diesel engines here in the Philippines, and charging an arm and a leg for it.

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  7. Easy solution, have your ECU reflash done in a reputable shop. Problem solved!

    You will just have to spend a little more.

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    1. I've read cases where the 120 horsepower variant can be reflashed to get close to 160 horsepower. I don't know what it'll do to long term reliability though. As it is, the 1.6 is running at high boost... Something like 20 psi if I remember right.

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    2. It's not that easy. The thai version has sequential twin turbos to achieve 160hp. Ours only has 1 turbo. There has to be a reason for that additional turbo

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    3. Actually James, tuners were able to match the twin turbo setup using an ECU reflash of the single turbo version. I'm just going to question its durability though.

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    4. I'm sure there will be repercussions in terms of durability, as well as engine response and driveability vis a vis the original. Honda would never go to the added complexity if it's wholly unnecessary

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    5. Waiting here for the Power to Weight Ratio proponents to discuss and advance their belief. What is the power to weight ratio of this model? Does anyone here cares?

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    6. Actually, you don't need to match the 160hp mark of the Thai spec CRV due to the absence of a Twin Scroll Turbo in the PH models. Just a significant improvement of let's say 20hp and 20-40nm Torque is enough which is achievable through ECU reflash. Just be cautious as with regards to over boosting.

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    7. Even the turbo'ed engine with 160 horsepower will have an effect on reliability and durability of the engine compared to the normally aspirated engines. Turbocharged/supercharged engines generally are. This is a third world country and many of us buy cars with hopes na magtatagal ang engine. Don't we think Honda considered it in the first place?

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    8. There are a lot of turbocharged cars that are being sold here in our country and the things, they last relatively long enough to be a good buy. Nasa pag aalaga ng may ari yan, except nalang kung lemon or defective car gaya ng Ford Fiesta at Focus.

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  10. Please bring in the 2017 CRV 1.5 turbo 2WD like in Malaysia

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  11. It's not the emission standards. We have the same with Thailand. It's cost. They're too caught up with competing with the other SUVs they forgot how to use their brain properly. Just how much higher would the stronger turbocharger cost? 20k 30k? Would that matter to those who can afford 1.6m? And people wouldn't mind paying a bit more for the better handling and comfort crossovers provide. Honda can be frustratingly stupid at times.

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  12. It's true that the european market has 120hp Civic diesel, and its basically the same engine block but with a different turbocharger unit. Probably this combination also allows it to have a significantly lower emission so its was put in the EU market Civic.

    Now the question is, will Honda PH still stick to this 120Hp when it refreshes the Model in the mid-cycle of the CR-V?
    Also, knowing that DOF will soon increase excise tax of cars which will increase the prices of ALL of the cars, and Honda may just spring up 160hp version which will definitely attract car buyers, especially those who watched and waited

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  13. People are too concerned with hp. Start looking at torque. And with 300nm thats a lot especially if it is at the low rpm range. Great for Pinas roads

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    2. 120 hp is good enough for a sedan.

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  14. Sir uly, will you test drive the crv cvt? Do you think thats the better choice againts the base diesel variant crv? Thank you

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    1. There's still no test drive available of the CR-V, but we'll definitely line up for it.

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  15. lahat na lang ng kotse na napapadpad dito sa bansa underpowered or tapyas features. naalala ko tuloy BRV sa india eh may diesel variant.

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  16. Honda Philippines should just release the BR-V i-DTEC here, price it around 1M and call it a day. It WILL eat Innova sales. It's atrocious how the CR-V has such a weak engine for such a big body. The Accent and Soul, which are much smaller, have a 136 hp and 320 nm from a similar 1.6L diesel. The BR-V might not be as posh or refined as the CR-V, but it's much lighter, more spacious (yes, it's actually more spacious in real world use, particularly the 3rd row) and fitting of compact diesel engine. Having a paltry engine on the CR-V just kills its more premium appeal.

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    1. You must be on drugs. Brv starts at 1m-1.2m with the base 1.5 gas engine. If they release brv diesel it here it would be priced 1.4m

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    2. Check India's pricing of the gas and diesel BR-V and see if it isn't possible. Diesel engines don't automatically make it super expensive. To be clear the BR-V doesn't start at "1m-1.2m". It starts at just a hair under 1M for the base model and tops out at 1.2M for the TOTL model. They can slot a diesel somewhere between that.

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    3. So you just converted inr to php and didn't factor in the fact that we have higher taxes? Pricing at 998k is just a marketing gimick so you wouldn't think its 1m. You're a bigger moron than I thought

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  17. HONDA IS SIMPLY UNDERESTIMATING THE PH MARKET.

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  18. Dumb comments to say the least.
    Honda brought in those diesel scrappage in this third world country since diesel everywhere is being phased-out. Honda has to find ways to disposed its garbage. And Phils. is a garbage disposal country - like those pre dinosaur kuliglig montero trailblazer fortuner mux pick up, heck! before honda dumps its garbage here, only the nissan and hyundai crdi here are modern, to say the least

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    Replies
    1. which countries are phasing diesel out?

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    2. Some Scandinavian countries. Countries like Germany and France have also announced measures to bad it in the next 20-40 years.

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  19. Bili kayo race chip, mga 30k lang yun, hindi ko alam ilan dagdag nun, pero sa 120hp accent naging 150+hp w/ 400+ torq, correct me if im wrong. But 11sec on stock is still fast for a big body.

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    Replies
    1. Race chip.. Yeah. And increase the risk of parts breaking down. Performance > Reliability... YOLO!!!!!!!

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  21. Sir Uly, if you were to choose between having this new crv diesel(s) or the ford everest which one will you pick? i know it is a weird comparison pero yan kasi both ang pinagpipilian ko now.. styling, fuel efficiency, ride height, cargo space are my main points in that order.. :) looking forward to your wisdom.. is the crv good in metro flash floods din ba?

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    1. Everest over the underpowered/overpriced CR-V, under-equipped Fortuner, SUA/ugly Montero and primitive MU-X/Trailblazer. Best bang-for-the-buck 7-seater SUV in this price range.

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    2. Styling: subjective.
      Fuel efficiency: to be determined. Likely CR-V will be btter.
      Ride height: Everest.
      Cargo space: Everest.
      Flood resistance: Everest.

      As much I love the Everest and its comfort, I cannot imagine driving that every single day. I don't need 7 seats and I won't drive through a flood, even if I owned a mid-sized SUV. Thus, my choice would be a CR-V. But, that's just me.

      Honda hasn't released any water wading figures for the CR-V, but I expect it to be no higher than 400 millimeters or half that of the Everest.

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    3. Sir Ulysses, can i ask for your comments and suggestion.
      Im buying car for my wife. Honda lang kasi choice niya. Between the CRV 2018 gas versus CRV na diesel, which is a better choice. 3 lang kami sa family. Ang driving mileage niya not exceeding .10kmk per year. Knowing a 200k difference between the 2 variants, which do you think is the better choice? BTW we are from Cebu City

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    4. The difference between the gas and diesel variants is only 30k not 200k. Obviously, the diesel is the better choice. What I'm concern, as with all new tech, is the push button electronic gear shifter of the diesel. Is it durable? I hope it is. Another thing, is it child proof enough. What if there is a kid with an ADHD who happens to like pushing buttons in front of him.

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    5. child proof, at least for the start/stop engine. I tried it while running at 60kph

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  22. The people who made the decision to bring the 120 hp CR-V do not know the people who buy the CR-V here in the Philippines. Know your customers.

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  23. I will wait for the 2019 Hyundai Sta. Fe. Hopefully, Hyundai Philippines would not remove the 4 or 5 airbags and just put 2 airbags again (if they'd do this I would buy the 2019 Forester).

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    Replies
    1. Knowing our local distributor HARI,imsure they'll trim down features to basic and make you pay more for them to put back what should be there.
      Their so called "GOLD" edition.

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  24. Do they even offer diesels in iron blocks anymore. You cannot kill those things through turbocharging

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  25. The AWD CR-V will need the 160 hp.

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  26. It seems that Honda Philippines is dumping their diesel engines, starting with the 120 hp units, here. Note that Honda will not have a diesel option for the 2018 CRV in Europe where 49% of all passenger vehicles sold in 2016 were diesel powered. Check Google.

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  27. Ok the bottom line here is "Honda Phil is making palusot to the Filipino customers". The real reason for releasing only the 120 HP is a "business decision" for them. Why?

    1 They want to be more competitive. If they release the 160 HP now and the price exceeds that of the more popular Mazda CX5, "pupulutin na sila sa kangkungan".
    2. Why not be flexible and release 120 HP and 160 HP at the same time? They won't, people, most likely will most likely not buy the 120 HP and they'll find it hard to dispose of it later. Likewise, they are afraid of "price shock" especially when the excise tax comes in. Their strategy is to make "takam" first to Filipions, so by the time the 160 hp is released, people are so eager to buy it.

    So for those who already bought the 2017 CRV Diesel turbo, I feel sorry for you guys. To those who are still on the planning stage, my advise is think twice before you join those "victimized" ones.

    Remember, patience is always a virtue and good things always happen to those who patiently wait.

    My own personal views and I am not asking anyone to follow this. I will definitely wait for the 160 HP Honda CRV Diesel.

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  28. Test drove the CRV Honda 120 HP top of the line yesterday at Honda Pasig color is red and here are my finding.

    The Good: All the new and latest features, tech and safety, are excellent and admirable except for the non-HD monitor in the dash.

    The Bad: Rev the engine to 3000+ rpm while at stand still, its diesel engine is very quiet. You can easily feel and realize that it's horsepower is barely enough for a seven-seater SUV on city driving to say the very least. Good thing the traffic along C5 is very heavy.

    Conclusion: The 120 HP 2017 Honda CRV diesel top of the line is the perfect CRV every released in the Philippines minus it's 120 HP engine. It's horsepower and torque is barely enough for city driving most especially along C5 and EDSA at peak, heavy traffic conditions. But if you will frequent Tagaytay and Baguio, it would surely be a different scenario for sure, as I personally feel after test driving it that it would never cruise with ease compared when you would be driving the Fortuner or Montero

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    1. You think the 120hp is barely enough because its too quiet when you revved it? You should be admiring the NVH of the car instead of using that as the yardstick for the car's power. And you should have actually driven it to Baguio or Tagaytay so you can give a definitive assessment.
      The conclusion, you just wasted not only Honda's time but everyone's including yours.

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  29. Kakainin ito ng buhay ng mga PPV SUV's

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  30. Great decision to have Honda sensing and panoramic sunroof vs. the 160hp in Thailand which do not have Honda sensing on their TOTL. It is cheaper too. Our CRV looks more premium than in Thailand where its made. Having lesser HP has still advantage of better fuel consumption considering Philippine road and traffic and maximum speed limits! Ill choose this CRV configuration vs the 160hp with no Honda sensing anytime.

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  31. Test drove both cx5 base model and crv diesel. Interior wise i would go for mazda for more detailed quality and i observe crv's fake wood trim is so low quality and how it is attached but the leather seat and head unit are very good quality. Diesel engine of crv is so quiet compare to others however i felt the lack of power with me flooring the gas pedal but i think it would be enough for a family car and if ur not looking for fun to drive and fuel economy. I think both have the same comfortable quality ride.

    I would go for mazda cx5 2.2 diesel that have more power with better quality interior and i love those bose so speaker and soul red crystal paint. With the almost same price you will get much more with ur money with cx5. Im getting this it nxt month

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  32. how about comparing it with Peugeot 3008 1.6 HDi 2017 model?

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  33. what is the top speed for the new crv diesel? Can they do 160 kph?

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  34. Excuses excuses.. If Honda have a problem with fuel/diesel grade in the Philippines.. all they are saying is all OTHER CAR BRANDS are better than them in dealing with that diesel grade here.. Whatever other excuse that Honda will come up with, always note that all other car brands have no problem with it..

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