Speaking of the BYD Seal, they are comparing the 0-100 time of the Seal Advanced which is 7.5s, so faster ung Camry with 7.2s.

Kaso, the Advanced is the lower trim costing 2m to the Camry's 2.677m. The Seal Performance, which is closer at 2.548m has a 0-100 of 3.8s.

It seems a bit of cherry picking on that point but whatever.

BYD Seal Advanced RWD EV Sedan is heavier than the vanilla made in Thailand Toyota Camry.
BYD Seal Performance EV Sedan is AWD with multiple electric motors and larger battery capacity.

Byd seal EV as rival of camry??? Ha ha ha the best joke of the year🤤🤤🤤

Correct. The BYD Seal is not a rival, it's way better, not even in the same category, AWD with a 3.8sec. 0-100, it's a sport sedan, not a pseudo-luxury midsize saloon. There's a reason why the Jap legacy brands are 15 years behind in EV tech.

Way better? 15 years behind??? Ha ha ha now its the best joke of the century🤣🤣🤣

The BYD seal's top speed is 180km/h. It's sad when you go fast but in the end, civics and other 3rd world vehicles overtake you eventually

In our country (or any 3rd world country for that matter)? I'd let people pass me if they are going faster than 180. You might overtake their burning wreck later on. lol

Is there such a thing?

no obviously there is not. But the front lighting and grille situation does slightly resemble the new Prelude

Slightly? If you were a non enthusiast, you'd easily mistake it for a prelude when looking at the front

hmm trueeee. But there's also a high chance that a non enthusiast would even know that a new prelude exists.

wouldn't*

People are talking numbers and when they're both sedans and close in price then they get compared.

The word 'rival' here can simply mean 'competitor' and is not limited to actual sales success.

Try not to overthink this.. 🙄

BYD, the Camry's rival? Ahhahahahahhahaha. That's funny.

The Camry is not selling in Toyota-obsessed PH. What makes you think the Accord will be worth bringing back?

should they really? :/ cause I personally don't think they care anymore.....They barely marketed the previous one, not even displaying it on their dealerships......How can they sell a model which they don't even simply display??? :(

The Mazda 6 2.5 Turbo is the closest to MazdaSpeed you can get here in the Phils and its interior and drive feel more premium - if you are ok with a tighter 2nd row. Sadly you can only get it from the used market.

If you have a driver, Camry has no competition.

Most likely the older Camry ones you saw as both vehicles still use the same platform,engine and body panels 😂😂

The Camry's been an OFW favorite for a while. I think they even make up the bulk of the buyers.

You're not gonna see more Seals than Camrys because they are full EVs and the demand for those are much lower, also because the Seal's looks more on the sportier side than classy.

Now, if BYD brought over the Han PHEV then there might be some real competition since it offers more of what people are looking for in the Camry.

I have yet to meet an OFW who owns or plans to buy a Camry. Most OFWs buy PPVs (Fortuner, Montero Sport, etc) or Avanzas and Xpanders.

@anon Nov 26 10:41 am

Think about this for a second.

The Camry only sells a few hundred units a year (in the whole country!). The chances of you personally knowing any of those owners is incredibly small.

So, out of that small pool of buyers a good number of them are OFWs (specifically those who have multiple cars already).

Maybe favorite is the wrong word? Let's say it attracts mostly OFWs, how about that?

Ok, I'll play along. How many OFWs do you personally know who own a Camry? And how many OFWs do you know who own at least 2 cars and are planning to buy a Camry as their 3rd car?

I honestly don’t know where you got the idea that the Camry is some kind of OFW staple. Since when did the Camry ever share the same shopping list as Isuzu Crosswinds, and every other diesel “pang-padala” favorite that ruled balikbayan garages for years? Even today, the usual choices are Innova, Fortuner, Montero : the "reliable", "practical", and let’s be frank, very safe, very predictable Filipino-abroad picks.

The Camry has never lived in that category. It’s always been the car you see assigned to presidents, lawyers, doctors, and executives... the people who walk out of offices, not from airport arrival areas hauling balikbayan boxes. Toyota themselves markets it that way. It’s the executive sedan; the quiet, refined choice, not the “siksikan, high-clearance, pang-family logistics” type of vehicle.

So this idea that the Camry “mostly attracts OFWs”? No. Absolutely not. That stereotype doesn’t line up with reality, the market data, or even the basic vibe of the car. It feels like something invented on the spot just to sound insightful.

To anon 1:23pm

Spot on, I couldn't have said it better myself. Maybe the commenter can't get over his ofw neighbor who parks his Camry beside the commenter's crosswind or avanza.

Always the car assigned to presidents? lol

I see that people commenting here are very far removed from the realities of actual rich people (no offense meant).

The Camry's not at a level where you use it to chauffeur dignitaries.

In our country? The PSG have a Camry in their fleet but that's not for the president. It's NEVER been a presidential car here. In other countries? I only found Laos who use them for their leaders, and guess what? They only use Camrys because they were downgrading from Mercedes Benzes because using actual luxury cars like those made them look corrupt.

So, talk about things being invented on the spot. lol

It doesn't matter what the intended vibe of the car is, it doesn't dictate who actually buys the car. You can have legit rich people driving your reliable and practical Fortuners and Monteros and you can have people who arent "yet" rich, blowing their money on a car they don't need. It's like you think people are following a strict mold on how they should behave. Like, car companies made pickups for off-road needs but people made them (mostly) city-bound family cars so that fails your vibe check too.

It's just a 2.7m car, people. Yes, JUST 2.7m. Which is easy for upper income (but not rich) families.

Maybe this is hard to grasp but there are tiers to OFWs. Yes, the OFWs you are talking about, who bring home balik-bayan boxes, are not the same ones looking to buy an executive sedan. That SHOULD have been obvious. But there are career workers who have been working decades as OFWs (in jobs with real room for advancement) and have globalized salaries that are comparable if not higher than some executives in the Philippines (emphasis on SOME because some people reading this might again think these statements are generalizing when they are not).

Do you even know how many Filipino high ranking career officers are serving in ships around the world? lol - It should be no surprise that they are part of the group who have the capacity to buy a car that's nice but that's not too much (like a BMW or a Mercedes which are like 50%+ more expensive).

Just to bring up the actual popularity of the Camry, it sold ONLY 351 units last year. So, for 2.7m do you think that's so out of reach for people who make 2-2.5m per year (upper income families)? Do you think there are so few people who fit that category? So then, what are the options for people who don't want to (or maybe can't) spend more for something like a MB or a BMW?

Do all/most OFWs who qualify (wealth-wise) want to own or actually buy one? No, many choose to re-invest their money in businesses or other things but some think money is easy and they can keep working for a few or many more years, so why shouldn't they buy that nice car? But with how few units actually sell it won't take much for them to be the common customer.

You people should get comfortable with the fact that the Camry is an achievable car for more people than you realize and who aren't that rich (and it's not even popular -period- to begin with at only 351 units sold last year). Also with the fact that top earning OFWs are part of that group. And is it really a surprise they might want to get a Camry since it is a car that's used as a taxi in many countries with OFWs?

I encourage everyone to travel the world if you can and meet and talk with people around the world (and OFWs which you are sure to run into). See how big the world is. It really helps prevent having a limited mindset on many topics. ✌️🕊️

@anon Nov 27 10:45 pm

You realize that your assumed scenario (meant as some kind of condescension, I guess?) would actually SUPPORT my previous statement, right? Right? Anyway, whatever. lol

Ang haba ng sinabi mo yet you still can't answer our question hahaha

It’s funny how confidently you lectured everyone about “real rich people” when you clearly misunderstood the very first premise. When I said “presidents,” I was obviously referring to corporate presidents, executives, senior officers... the people who actually move through boardrooms, not state motorcades. Anyone who has ever stepped inside an office tower in Makati, Ortigas, or BGC knows exactly what that means. You somehow jumped straight to Malacañang convoys like it was a State of the Nation Address. That misunderstanding alone already shows the gap between what you think you’re correcting and what was actually said.

And just so we’re grounding this in real-world context: I personally know someone who lives in Forbes Park... yes, the Forbes Park you’re thinking of, whose company service car is a Camry with a full-time driver. The Camry is the car he uses when going to the office. In that world, the Camry is the discreet, comfortable executive shuttle. Not the “flex” car, not the luxury showcase, not the weekend toy.... just a dependable executive sedan. That’s how people with actual money treat it.

Your long explanation about OFW income tiers, globalized salaries, maritime officers, and sociology of overseas workers is strangely overdefensive and entirely unrelated to the original point. No one said OFWs “cannot afford” a Camry; affordability was never the issue. The question was always about behavior, buying patterns, and market positioning. Toyota did not design or market the Camry to the same demographic patterns as the Montero, Fortuner, Innova, or Hilux, which historically sit in the “padala-class” diaspora markets. The Camry’s actual Philippine buyers, based on fleet usage, corporate allocations, and dealership placement, skew toward executives, managers, medical professionals, and firms needing something more refined than a PPV but less ostentatious than a Euro brand. That is simply how the car is situated in our market.

Your argument essentially boils down to “some OFWs can afford it, therefore the Camry is an OFW car,” which makes about as much sense as saying that because some OFWs buy iPhones, the iPhone is now an OFW phone. Affordability does not dictate the cultural identity of a product, and it certainly does not override decades of actual market behavior.

You also highlight that only 351 Camrys were sold last year. Exactly. With numbers that small, what makes you think this tiny sliver of customers is dominated by the specific OFW demographic you are imagining? Vanishingly few units, mostly corporate purchases and a minority of private buyers and Toyota’s own sales reps will confirm that the typical walk-ins for this model are professionals and executives. OFWs buying a Camry absolutely happens, but it is not the “default profile,” and pretending otherwise is pure projection.

And the global taxi argument? Again, irrelevant to our market. Lots of cars are used as taxis abroad: the Prius, the E-Class, the Superb, the Sonata, the Accord… none of those are considered OFW-identity vehicles here just because another country’s fleet managers made bulk purchases. Local identity does not magically import itself from Dubai, Singapore, or Australia.

To be clear, no one is gatekeeping who can or cannot buy a Camry. Buy whatever you want. Drive whatever you want. The problem is you took a simple observation about market identity and turned it into a dissertation about class mobility, OFW sociology, and a world tour of taxi fleets all while completely misreading the initial point.

If anything needs correcting here, it’s that.

@anon Nov 29 4:02 pm
are you the same person as Nov 27 1:23 pm?
Because if so let's talk about how you say I'm missing the points of your previous comment.

Ok. So you were talking about -corporate- presidents. I concede that point but I'd argue it wasn't that clear to begin with since I'd personally lump them with executives which you mentioned separately, but maybe that's just me (personal failing).

"Not the “flex” car.. just a dependable executive sedan." And OFWs in the upper income bracket somehow won't want that too?

I don't care who you know who fits your stereotype. I know who Toyota markets them to, I know people in that bracket haven't abandoned the Camry (completely). You don't need to keep repeating it. lol

But like I said, having a specific target market doesn't mean only they will buy into it. You seem to have ignored my points relating to this. And you say that, "needing something more refined.. but less ostentatious than a Euro brand" which is (basically) the same as what I said?

Your saying my argument boils down to “some OFWs can afford it, therefore the Camry is an OFW car,” is an extreme interpretation. And your comparison to phones (an amusing false equivalency) only highlights this. "Affordability does not dictate the cultural identity of a product" The irony of saying this right after using the iPhone as an example...yeesh.

You saying lots of cars are used as taxis abroad, while correct, misses the point I was making. So, OFWs would be constantly exposed to different cars as taxis, and which of those cars you mentioned would impress an OFW? Maybe make them think they'd like a car like that too? You (and I both) said a euro car's too much, so what is left?

"No one said OFWs “cannot afford” a Camry"

Much of my response was due to this part; "Since when did the Camry ever share the same shopping list as Isuzu Crosswinds.. that ruled balikbayan garages for years?...the usual choices are Innova, Fortuner, Montero", which I see as you wrongly interpreting my previous comment where you seem to be assuming that we're talking about the average OFW.

Are you also the anon from Nov 26 10:41 am, who said;
"I have yet to meet an OFW who owns or plans to buy a Camry."
and maybe also the anon from Nov 27 8:33 am, who said;
"Ok, I'll play along. How many OFWs do you personally know who own a Camry?"

Because if you are not the same person, then, please, establish the context of the convo completely before you make such a statement.

"To be clear, no one is gatekeeping who can or cannot buy a Camry." shows you're ignoring the obvious gatekeeping happening further up.

I'm fine with being wrong, but you're not doing a good job being convincing, tbh. I don't care if you don't believe me. Maybe the OFW community in my city is the odd one that likes Camrys. If you have irrefutable sales data then I would appreciate you sharing that with me.

But I want to end on this point, answering what you say here; "With numbers that small...mostly corporate purchases and a minority of private buyers ...typical walk-ins for this model are professionals and executives.",
by pointing you to this old article here on carguide from 2018 "7 Things Toyota Motor Philippines Revealed about the Camry Buyer " where it says that, "Mazda [with the Mazda6] went straight for the self-driven individual" and that "#6. Camry wants some of the Mazda6’s market" meaning Toyota has been wanting for a while already to go after those who aren't just driven around and actually like to drive themselves. So, perhaps Toyota has been more successful in this endeavor and you (and maybe even the Toyota dealerships you've asked) just haven't seen this be the case in your area. Even the original comment from Nov 25 1:53 pm says, "Camry is becoming more of a driver's car." (oh the irony if this was also you, lol)

If you don't like how the discussion evolved (messy, in my view, with the amount of missed points), then you are free to not continue with this. As I said, I'm fine with being wrong but maybe you're just not the right person to make me see that?

@anon Nov 29 4:02 pm

I just realized it! You ran my comment through AI didn't you? I think it's the weirdness of your 3rd and 4th paragraph specifically that stuck out to me. It explains the lost context of the general conversation and the mistakes like repeating some of my own points back to me.

I may be wrong but it's just reads weird. I think only the first two paragraphs are your personal writings. If true, nako, wag ganun sir/ma'am. 😅

Relax lang. I wasn’t the one who said “OFW favorite”. Ikaw talaga yun. You made that claim out of nowhere, so the burden to actually prove it is on you. You can’t drop a stereotype like a hot take then expect everyone else to “disprove” your imagination for you.

And let’s be honest, your entire basis for “Camry = OFW car” is literally just your OFW community in your city. Anecdotes aren’t market data, they’re just neighborhood chismis with better grammar.

The reality is simple: the Camry’s known buyer base here has always skewed toward execs, doctors, lawyers, managers, and corporate fleets. If you want to overturn that with “pero sa amin, may OFW na may Camry" that’s… cute, but not exactly industry research.

If you really believe OFWs are the primary Camry buyers today, sige, show numbers. Actual sales breakdowns. Otherwise, it stays as a personal headcanon. Nothing wrong with that, just don’t present it like gospel truth.

And about the AI thing... no, that was me. I just write cleanly. If clear writing automatically reads as AI to you, maybe that says more about your usual reading diet than my comment. 😎

@anon Dec 1 4:09 pm

I already dialled back from the word favorite in my comment on Nov 27 1:30 am by saying, "Maybe favorite is the wrong word? Let's say it attracts mostly OFWs, how about that?" so you're really invested in the use of the word that I've already admitted was too strong of a descriptor. You've repeatedly shown to be ignoring multiple points I've raised in this convo chain so I'm not gonna act surprised going forward. lol

"Anecdotes aren’t market data, they’re just neighborhood chismis with better grammar." If you go back between our exchanges, YOU are actually the first person to use an anecdote to try and push your position with your Forbes park guy. The fact that you're pushing this now (and while I agree on the lack of merit of anecdotes - and I did answer in turn with my own anecdote despite knowing this) shows inconsistency in your logic (and perhaps even some questionability with your integrity by conveniently ignoring that fact).

"Actual sales breakdowns" > you also said; "The Camry’s actual Philippine buyers, based on fleet usage, corporate allocations, and dealership placement, skew toward executives, managers, medical professionals, and firms needing something more refined than a PPV but less ostentatious than a Euro brand." How about YOU show ME where you got these very specific details? It seems that saying stuff like this makes it seem that you have a very strong source. I already said I am open to being wrong so why don't you be the bigger person and show ME these numbers?

"And about the AI thing... no, that was me. I just write cleanly. If clear writing automatically reads as AI to you, maybe that says more about your usual reading diet than my comment. "

Yeah, like I said, "I may be wrong but it just reads weird.", it may be the overly confident nature of your writing style accompanied with your disregard of many points raised by me and the subsequent conclusions you've made as a result of ignoring those points and the confident statements you added at the end there (that I pointed out - about the no gatekeeping, and about no one saying things that WERE said [and I qouted] - and which you continue to not address me on after having them pointed them out) that makes me think it MIGHT be AI (i.e. because of the mistakes and missed context)...that's not meant to be a compliment. lol

"Nothing wrong with that, just don’t present it like gospel truth."

So many of my statements already contained qualifiers that show that I am open to being wrong so I'm not sure why you would think I am (or that I believe that I am) presenting a position that bears no argument. I added a lot of context that I believe support my position which you then called, "[a] long explanation [that is] overdefensive and entirely unrelated to the original point".

Your consistent contorting of the context of the conversation is the main focus of much of my respones (I think I've made it clear I don't care about being proven wrong, though I do enjoy the thought exercise of the discussion).

No matter how "cleanly" you say you write, the fact that I have had to point you back to the many parts where you are misinterpreting (or outright misrepresenting) my statements (or the context which are the basis of those statements) shows you need to "cleany" read what you are responding to because the result of not doing so is, as I have mentioned before, a messy discussion.

And while I enjoy the process of having a discussion like this (even from the position where I may end up being proven wrong in the end), the experience is soured by the (numerous) moments of inconsistency, in the logic, in the misinterpretations, and in the points (that I would argue do bear addressing) that are brushed aside which (to me) makes this whole back-and-forth rather unfulfilling. 😩

what's up with these guys and their long wall of texts? man, this is what I'm afraid AI would do to intellectually lazy people. look at their false sense of confidence haha, it's hilarious

@anon Dec 2 3:15 pm

You haven't seen people on the internet throw walls of text at each other before? This has been happening waaay before AI, dude.

If you think we are both using AI (I'm assuming you didn't bother to read much/anything) then you calling other people 'intellectually lazy' is both ironic and amusingly pretentious.

I hope this comment's not too long that you need a TL:DR. lol

Wala nang honda accord sa pinas. Camry meron dito. Havent u know?

Who knows Honda Philippines could bring it in under their new management now that Ayala is gone.

Guys, Ayala dealerships lang ang ni let go.........They still have stake sa brand itself, along with the Yuchengcos

@anon Nov 27 12:00 pm

You can repeat it as many times as you want but some people really want to make it out like Ayala is/was the big reason why X happened or why Y didn't happen. 😅

But like you said, dealerships lng ang ni-manage nila. Even with their remaining stake, it's people in Japan who are (and who always have been) making the big decisions. Even with brands where they are (or were) the distributor, it's still people high up in Europe (VW), China (BYD), and Korea (KIA) who have the major influence in the manufacturer/supplier-distributor relationship.

^^ exactly lol. They make it as if Ayala is the main distributor of Honda. I wouldn't be surprised though if they sell their stake in the future given that they already gave up their dealership operations. Mas nauna pa sila kay Yuchengco in completely divesting that portion, YCG still kept some despite giving up 5 branches if I remember correctly?

Well it only mean your not the target market

^

The target market is pretty much non existent. The primary reason Toyota is still bringing in the Camry is because they could afford to do so, add that there is practically no competitor in the segment anymore.

They dont care whether they sell this or not.

Anon 11:36 - YOU are also NOT its target market

lol at the random call out

YOU are NOT the -fath...erm, TARGET MARKET! 🤣

(like what's the point of doing that? lol)